GYMN-L Digest - 10 Apr 1996 to 11 Apr 1996

There are 6 messages totalling 234 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. Oprah Winfrey/Joan Ryan
  2. Canadian RGS
  3. Judging in Mexico
  4. Full Out Technique
  5. full out technique
  6. Woolsey and Worlds


Date:    Wed, 10 Apr 1996 22:25:02 -0400
From:    ***@AOL.COM
Subject: Oprah Winfrey/Joan Ryan

As promised, I am informing all of you on the GYMN of the air date of the
Oprah Winfrey show concerned with  "Pretty Girls in Little Boxes" by Joan
Ryan.  It will air this coming Monday, April 15th.

The show was not, as the producer had suggested, balanced.  The in-gym
footage and interviews done at our gym were edited down so that only the
answers the girls gave that supported the book's thesis were shown.  The
majority of their comments relating to  their enjoyment and love for
gymnastics ended up on the cutting room floor.  The guests and Oprah's
questions all were geared to support the thesis.  I was able to interject a
short comment at the end of the show to express my dismay at this fact, and
to relate some of the positive aspects which come out of participation in the
sport.  However, I would not be surprised if this too ends up as excessed

I would urge all members to watch the show, and to tell everyone they know
involved in our sport to view it.  I will provide the fax # for anyone
interested in writing a rebuttal.


Date:    Wed, 10 Apr 1996 21:33:28 -0500
From:    ***@CARLETON.EDU
Subject: Canadian RGS

I there anyone on the list fairly well versed in Canadian RGS who's/who
past and present.  I have some questions that I've been wondering about.

Thanks Meg


Date:    Thu, 11 Apr 1996 00:26:37 -0400
From:    ***@BBS.CINCOS.NET
Subject: Judging in Mexico

In Mexico there are three types of judges:
State- You can judge all meets except Nationals
National- You can judge all meets in Mexico as long as they're not
FIG brevet

Judges are suposed to be paid according to the type of judge you are but you
never are.  I'm a National judge and all the meets I have judged I have been
paid $50 pesos a session (about $7 U.S. dlls) the same as all other judges
(sate and brevet).  I also get paid for meals, hotel and transportation by
the club which I represent.  At  meets every club (or state at Nationals)
is required to bring 2 judges so usually all judges are club affiliated.
I've even seen a judge not be alowed to judge because nobody from her club
was competing.   I coach at a small club so the club only has 2 judges,
myself and another judge so at the State  Meet (which was used to select the
team that would represent the state at Nationals) I judged even though I was
the coach of some the girls who I judged but there many other coach/judges.
There is deffinitly a conflict of interest and it's not a very plesant
experience but that's the way things are.



Date:    Thu, 11 Apr 1996 01:16:45 -0400
Subject: Full Out Technique

One way for athletes to produce the twist, as mentioned was the "cat
twist".  Normally, we consider the athlete rotating around the transverse
axis in the double tuck.  That is the axis which would pass through our
left side through our centre of gravity (somewhere near our bellybutton
 but a few inches into our tummies) and out the right side of our
bodies.  If we forget about that rotation and imagine
the athlete in free space, basic biomechanics tell us they can't generate
any angular momentum (twist) unless acted upon by an external force.  We
do know however that the athlete can move their mass about he centre of
gravity and that for every movement of mass on one side of the Cof G
there is going to be an equal and opposite displacement on the other side
fo the C of G.  We must also understand what a moment of inertia is... it
is the distance of the mass away from the C of G.  Now, think of a
straight body in free space.  We have a longitudinal axis running
straight down through the top of their head, through their C of G and
straight down between the legs.  This is the axis we twist around.  If
the athlete pulls their upper body in very tight they shorten their
moment of inertia allowing that part of their body to turn faster.  If
they pike or arch they move the mass of their lower body away from the
axis creating a larger moment of inertia, making that part of their body
twist slower.  So, keeping in mind that if they twist their upper body to
the left, their lower body will twist to the right (equal and opposite),a
nd their upper body is able to twist faster than their lower body, their
upper body may complete a quarter twist, while their slow, lower body
only does an eighth of a twist.  Then they reverse it.  Bring the lower
body in close tot he axis and extend the arms away from the axis, thereby
slowing down the upper body and speeding up the lower body.  The lower
body completes a 1/4 twist to the left, causing the upper body to twist
right (equal and opposite) 1/8.  So in total, the body has rotated 1/8 to
the left, without any external force acting upon it.  While this is far
from a full out it explains how the twist occurs.

Secondly, there is a "tilt twist".  In a double back the angular momentum
is acting around the transverse axis.  If the athlete moves their arms to
the right side of their body (in other words to the right of their C of
G), as mentioned above, and equal and opposite reaction will occur.  That
reaction is that their lower body will move to the left.  This results in
a tilt of the body.  Now the angular momentum which was acting around the
transverse axis is acting partially upon the transverse and partially
around the longitudinal, depending on how much tilt occured.  Stand up
straight, where you are, and imagine yourself rotating backwards
and imagine the force flipping you backwards as a force directly in front
of you, like a pole pushing directly into your forehead.  Now imagine, without
moving your centre of gravity, that you are leaning to the right.  The force,
has not moved but
it's now applying itself to your body differently, perhaps upon your left
shoulder and while its still flipping you backwards to certain extent it
is also turning you to the left, creating your twist, much like someone
who stand in front of you and shoves you on the left shoulder.  It's
known as an off-centre thrust.  So again we generate a left twist however
this time we do use and external force.  That force is the angular
momentum (or flip) we get from our set off the floor or beam or our
release from the bar.  We just manipulate our bodies around the centre of
gravity so that the force is applied differently.

Well, it's late and this is pretty long so if you're still with me I hope
this helped somewhat.  If I've made any errors please let me know cause
my brains a little fried with assignments due in the next few days.




Date:    Thu, 11 Apr 1996 09:24:49 -0500
From:    ***@IMT.SE
Subject: Re: full out technique

Mary Lynn Wrote:
>At gymn camp in 1975, we were told that a full-out was technically
>impossible because there would be no way to begin the twist in the
>second salto.  Obviously not true.  But why?  How do gymnasts generate
>the twist on the second salto?  Any special training techniques? I
>have some ideas, based on memories of fulls and science films of cats
>twisting in the air to land on their feet, but I would appreciate a
>mechanical (and more accurate!) explanation.  Thanks.
>--Mary Lynne

It is correct to say that you can't generate a twist if you don=B4t have a =

reaction from the floor. It is the same to say that if you just jump =

straight up in the air it is impossible to start a twist on your way =


But this is not the whole story though. Why is it possible to start a =

twist in the second salto without the posibility to create a reaction. =

The answer is that it is possible to generate a twist if you steal =

rotation energy from the salto. There is a lot more rotation energy i a =

salto than in a twist therefore it is possible to transform some of the =

energy from the salto into a twist. In fact the rotation in the salto =

slows down a bit but to little even to be noticed.

I beleve that this happens also when you twist with a reaction from the =

floor. It is a combination of the two.

How is this transformation possible? This is more difficult to explain =

only with words. I will try. When you do a salto backwards the technique =

is that you press one schoulder down and look at it, what the arms do is =

diffrent for different techniques. If you split the body symmetricly =

from the head to the feets it is easy to see that the side with a =

shorter shoulder would rotate faster because it is closer to the wheght =

point. What happens when, in a salto, one side of your body rotates =

faster than the other? You twist!

I am not a teacher, but i hope this is understandeble and will give you =

some new ideas about twisting techniques.

/Henrik Lundin


Date:    Thu, 11 Apr 1996 04:52:33 -0500
From:    ***@EDEN.COM>
Subject: Woolsey and Worlds

I think my saddest moment in gymnastics was watching these hoardes of little
girls at '91 Worlds scrambling for autographs....except for Sandy's.  She
was in uniform and was still the official alternate, but I remember her
coming out of the tunnel and no one clamboring after her.  As one coach
whispered to me--How easy we forget....

I'm glad she is doing well in NCAA.



End of GYMN-L Digest - 10 Apr 1996 to 11 Apr 1996